Warlock Speed ISS Stacking

The warlock has 3 similar Item Set Skills that increase it's movement speed. Usually when a class has similar Item Set Skills with different power levels you can only use one at a time.

The Champion lvl 99 ISS skill with 15% dodge cannot be used with the lvl 70 10% dodge.

The Druid lvl 99 ISS can't be used with the lvl 75 ISS.

The Mage lvl 99 ISS can't be used with the lvl 70 ISS.

The Warden lvl 98 ISS can't be used with the lvl 67 ISS.

What adds to the problem is that I think the percentages are stacking multiplicatively. So the lvl 99 ISS skill that gives 60% movement speed is stacking with the lvl 90 ISS that gives 30% movement speed. But in Siege, that 30% movement speed buff ends up being 126% added movement speed to the base movement speed because they're stacking in a multiplicative way.

In siege, where players get a 50% movement buff from stable, and can have a destiny ring that stacks with the ISS skills, and a spellweaver potion that also stacks, players are getting a 547% movement speed buff!!!!!!!! So that's 6.47x the base speed. It's like on top of a 421% speed buff they get another 126% just from that 30% ISS skill.

Warlocks are so fast you can't even use the cast skills in the game before someone is out of range or behind you. So I don't feel like it was intended to be this way. If it was we'd only have instant skills.

I also think it's the cause of some crashes and rubber banding in siege.

This has been an issue for months and months between the top two siege guilds. People have rage quit. People have just quit. Obviously the warlocks don't want to admit it's not right. I can understand not wanting to lose an advantage. I've really tried to work it out between the players and just self impose the a rule not to stack them but they just won't agree.

I really hope someone can look at this and realize there's a problem. I just want to siege. I don't want to deal with this issue anymore. It's been so long the same issue every night. Warlocks coming out of nowhere. Impossible to target. Sure both sides have some fast ones usually but it still makes everyone else super mad. It makes so many people angry.

Thanks for your time.

I didn't want to say years and sound like I was exaggerating so thank you. Also I forgot about the 10% escape artist title so that brings it to like 602% and that one 30% ISS stacking that shouldn't adds 139% base movement speed.

I actually didn't realize the Self-Distortion skill existed. My bad. I did realize the ones stacking were not identical of course. I thought the difference was why it was being overlooked. But now I think having identical versions that don't stack might be why they didn't think it would be an issue.

And, just because they're not exactly the same doesn't mean there can't be a reason they shouldn't stack or be so strong.

What if it's causing crashes and rubber banding?

What if all the other speed buffs were not considered like the destiny ring, title and more?

And most importantly, what if how they're stacking multiplicatively wasn't considered or wasn't intended?

If any of those things are true then maybe there is a very good reason they shouldn't stack or be so strong.

As for you not having a problem with the speed and enjoying the challenge that's great but the fact is there's many that do have a problem with it and are super angry about it. I have proof of that if needed.

And I never said I'm expecting people not to move. My point was that if it was really intended for any player to be so fast they probably wouldn't have so many cast skills. And therefore, it's unlikely it was really intended to be this way.

It's not perfect logic I admit. But I honestly don't feel like the current speed warlock can get was intended. It seems like there's was a mistake made somewhere or something wasn't considered. It's so easy to do in a huge game like this.

If it was a tiny issue or if it didn't affect people so much I would not be here. This issue has caused thousands of lines of chat in our discord. This one issue. To me that hints to the possibility that something is very wrong.

And to many of us it's not even a debate anymore. If it was close I'd say it was close. But it's far from close. It's lightyears from close. And I really hope that also tells the people in charge something.

I really hope my mistake doesn't ruin the chances of this issue getting fixed for everyone. I'm very sorry if it does.

It's not about classes. Nobody is arguing some are better than others.

PVP is very sensitive to movement speed and there's a specific issue with one class' speed. Most people like you realize it's broken. They move faster than sonic the hedge hog. I don't think it was intended at all. It's not that type of game imo.

Maybe the ISS skills were added at different times by different programmers. Maybe they had limited time to test it. Maybe they tested with only a few buffs and didn't realize it was multiplicative. Or didn't test much in siege.

If you just have a few buffs you may only go 3x faster and it may seem reasonable. But when you add even more buffs, that buff all the previous buffs, it gets so crazy.

I don't think many people realize what's happening. One 30% ISS skill is adding 139% base movement speed on top of about 600% movement speed for like 739% total. That one 30% ISS skill is buffing the 50% stable buff and that's an extra 15%. It's buffing the other 60% ISS so another 24%. It's buffing the destiny ring, the spellweaver, the title, and even the base movement speed.

If they just added all the buffs together it would only be about 210% speed buff. And there's no way they're only moving 3x normal speed. It has to be multiplying off each other. Basically they get up to about 8x the base speed if my math is correct. And that's exactly what it looks like.

It's insanely fast.

Right so you agree they were added at different times and most likely not fully tested.

I'm not sure if you think it was all most likely intended or just them stacking in multiplicative way.

But it doesn't really matter, what matters is if the end result is what they wanted and if it makes sense.

To most of us it's not even a question. There's zero doubt in our minds. Zero zilch none nada.

It's just a matter of identifying the exact problem and asking for a fix.

I think realizing how the buffs are stacking and how much difference two ISS skills stacking make is very important.

Keep in mind, this is not just a damage or loot buff this is the player speed in a game with PVP where range is very limited and you must be facing target.

A game where many classes are melee and don't have a single ISS speed buff let alone two that stack.

People want to argue that some classes are better than others but there is a thing called balance.

You don't want everyone playing one class or almost being forced to play one class in PVP.

You can argue until you're blue in the face that it's not doing that and that there's many counters but it's not what many of us believe.

Plus it could be causing crashes and rubber banding.

Warlocks are going to fight tooth and nail against this of course.

But what they won't do is pretend like they're not that fast.

They shift the focus to anything and everything else.

But the issue is the warlock speed ISSs. It's a simple problem and issue.

We're just asking they have a look at it.

We don't want a debate. We feel there's problem end of story.

All we can do is ask. If you want to ask them not to look into it go ahead.

OR make them think there's no point go ahead.

Give it all you got.

But at the end of the day, I'm begging the people in charge, please look at a siege video with a warlock at mach speed and see if you think that was really intended.

Again I don't want to debate classes. It's not the point. The point is the speed issue I feel exists.

I've never seen a knight move like a warlock.

As for crashes unless you're a tech at gameforge how would you know.

All this get better stuff is just to distract from the issue I'm trying to bring to light.

Some classes are betters than others. Warlocks can get stunned and killed. That doesn't automatically make the speed stacking right or correct.

It has nothing to do with being bullied by warlocks. It's a game mechanic that seems broken to me.

Please stop trying to make it look like something else that it's not.

To you it's not a big deal to others it is.

When I say we I'm talking for many players in my guild and other guilds that I've known for a long time.

This is not just one person being bullied.

This is an issue that's been a problem for months if not years.

We've talked about it so much but we have no power to change anything.

This is the only place we can hope to change things.

We don't want to debate with the warlocks but we don't want your nonsense left unchecked either.

I can prove what I'm saying. It's all on video. Show me a knight move like a warlock lol. It's total nonsense.

The more you post the more you bring attention to it so please do. I'll keep debating all you want.

It's not what I want but it might help. I rather just let the people in charge make a decision.

To me there's really nothing to talk about. It's not even a debate. Everything you're saying is ridiculous imo.

This is not about me or how I play warlock at all.

You're trying to distract from the issue and I won't let you.

It is not just me.

Listen to the audio and you'll hear it's not just me.

To me it's not a debate and you're grasping at straws.

Instead of talking about the speed and ISS skills you're trying to shift the blame because you know you can't explain the speed.

Even if I'm playing bad and I'm the worst player in the world that doesn't mean there's not a problem with warlock speed.

To me and many others, it's not even close to being worth discussing if it's a game skill issue. Not for one second.

It's obvious to most of us that the speed is out of control and not right.

Think I suck all you want I don't care.

I'm actually posting to help solve the issue for many people.

It's not just me. It's actually less me and more for them.

You just have to look at it. The speed is insane. Nobody in their right mind can even argue it imo.

Anyone who argues it is probably a warlock or has other motives like a personal issue with me.

And I wouldn't just make that up. It takes a lot for me to say people are not making sense and not being genuine.

If there was even the slightest chance it was a skill issue. A tactic issue. I'd be open to discuss it.

It's just not even close by a longshot.

And if I'm so oblivious and wrong then why even respond? Wouldn't the people in charge think the same thing?

Or are you just trying to discredit me so they don't look at the issue?

You sure went through a lot of trouble for something you think is just one person who plays bad.

It's not just me. Listen to the siege videos. The evidence is all there. From multiple guilds videos.

Thinking it over maybe you are genuine. Maybe you really think everyone that has an issue with the warlock speed is not very good and didn't pick the best class combo to counter them. Almost anything is possible.

But what I'm saying is that maybe all those bad players and all those combos that don't do as good against fast warlocks were not intended to be so bad against warlocks. Maybe there was a mistake. An oversight made.

You guys can't be open to that idea? Why not? Afraid they look into it and realize there's a problem?

Why not just say ya it's possible. It is pretty fast. Maybe have a look. I think it's just bad players but there's a small chance it's too fast.

Say that and I'll say there's a small chance it's just all bad players.

Otherwise agree to disagree. Let those in charge decide if it's worth a look or not.

But also I think I'm smart enough to recognize when something is an issue because of skill or tactic or because of broken game mechanic.

And when so many feel the same way it's hard to deny.

It's not like we're all pointing at different things. We're all pointing in one direction over and over and over.

As I've heard one guild member say so many times. It's total BS.

It's not ah, i had a chance and blew it. It's not that skill might be overpowered. It's always that's total BS no question about it. Just saying.

I'd be happy to for a mod or someone in charge. I have no reason or desire to prove anything to you. The proof is there if you want really want to hear it.

Even if I improve that wouldn't fix a game mechanic issue if there is in fact a game mechanic issue right?

You don't think there's an issue but many of us do.

For us there's no point debating it because it's not even in the realm of being close. Anything is possible but when it's so far out of this world why waste your time. All I can think is people are very biased or not being genuine.

On the other hand, it should be easy to admit there might be a small problem yet you don't. So if you can't do that then why bother debating.

Maybe it's all a matter of perspective. But I'm pretty open minded I think. If a problem could be for many reasons I try to be open to all the reasons.

Your reason would make sense if the speed was borderline. It's not even close to borderline.

That's an opinion but a fair one I think. I'm asking myself if it's fair. Is there a chance it's not fair. And the answer is no. The speed is totally undeniably crazy. And when it's that obvious and some people try to argue against something so obvious I question their motivates or ability to reason.

So I hope I'm at least clear on what I think about the issue.

Often, when people don't have any good arguments, they start putting the other person down.

I understand your opinion you don't have to keep repeating it unless you're trying to get the thread closed.

so you admit having rubber banding thank you