Posts by pescaru98

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Ainz

    91o49x.jpg


    * you can find an explanaition here: Serverwartung 21.11 it's german but i guess google translate will do the job


    I translated the post, and I loved to see that it confirms (and more than that, it completes) my previous post about 32bit/64bit compilation.


    This is a great explanation! From your shared article, I understand that a Windows 64bit OS can increase the max limit of allocated memory of a process to 4GB (by setting the IMAGE_FILE_LARGE_ADDRESS_AWARE flag). And, as I understand, you supposed that RoM does not take advantage of all these 4GB, since it crashes before reaching 3GB of the allocated memory


    Also, it makes sense what you said about the connection between 32bit client and the game crashing: the limitation of 2GB/3GB/4GB given by the 2^32 possible memory adressing makes the client reach the max allocated memory (due to memory leaks) faster, than if it was built on 64bit.


    I'd have a brief conclusion to this: there are only 2 options, in regard of fixing this problem:

    1. Developers can try building the client on 64bit, but the biggest headache, in my oppinion, are the 3rd party libraries which can lack 64bit support, considering there's a 16 yrs old game.

    2. Developers can try analyzing the source code and observe where the memory leaks come from. A common and very visible case where memory leak occur is at transporting to another zone (personally, I get most of the crashes because of it)


    Thank you for your answers!

  • Game Crashing


    Also, regarding my previous post, I wanted to mention that, personally, I'm not even sure if the fact that the client is built on a 32bit architecture is the real reason behind the game crashing.


    Diogenes said in a previous post: "Runes of Magic is still running of a 32bit client and having issues with memory leak.". And regarding this quote, I'm still waiting for further explanation, because 32bit software should still run properly on Windows 10/11. I don't understand why would you blame the 32bit architecture of a software, for having game crashes

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Kartoffelschmuser

    As for RoM crashes: They occur due to memory issues that occur due to the extremely outdated 32bit architecture. They will never be fixed as that would require a complete rewrite of the entire client.

    Hello,


    Thank you for your reply! I keep hearing about updating the game build to 64bit architecture, instead of 32bit architecture, is a meaning of completely rewriting the client and is a very complex procedure.


    As of my research and knowledge, this is not a generally valid statement. The action of switching a software project from a 32bit to a 64bit (and vice-versa) architecture is a matter of few minutes/hours. You just have to specify the compiler/interpreter in which architecture you want to build the project. BUT, even if the compilter/interpreter managed to create a build, that doesn't mean the game will work fine.


    This architecture switch can cause alot of problems. You have to check what 3rd party libraries you used, what variables you used (certain variables allocate more memory at 64bit). In short, you have to test alot, after such modification, as switching to a 64bit, but I think you don't have to rewrite the client

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Grumpdaddy

    Also- people who run the game in Linux say they don't crash. I suppose if you want to go full-on geek, you can give that a try. Personally, I'm too lazy.

    I read a debate about running the game in Linux, and as I remember, the game would also crash in Linux (but I'm not sure if I remember well).

    But, even if RoM wouldn't crash in Linux, no one can't ask people to move on Linux based OS's, especially considering Windows has a market share of 72%. The game should work fine on Windows


    I'm still looking forward for further updates and informations, if the technical team investigated anything regarding the game crash problem

  • Game Crashing

    Hello,


    It has been a month since I started this topic, and almost a month since I got an answer that the request was forwarded. Do we have any updates?


    Thank you!

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Ainz

    no, Gameforge bought the rights to publish runesofmagic in europe and NA from runewaker. TD22 has the rights to publish it in asia.

    In short, the business model of GF is to sell Dia.

    runewaker has developed runes of magic and provides new content and support as long as GF pays for it.

    In short, the business model of RW is to sell a compiled piece of software and provides support/updates and gets paid for it.

    the source code of the client is owned by RW (it was leaked a few years ago through an ex RW employee together with some rough information about the business model that have indicated that the publishers have no insight into the sourcecode -> kinda obvious when you think about it... if gf had the source code legally, they won't have to give RW money).


    Quote from Grumpdaddy
    Quote from pescaru98

    I'd think that RW is paying GF for having the game posted on their platform. Isn't that so ?

    No. Gameforge PUBLISHES the game, the same way a book publisher publishes a book. Runewaker wrote and owns the code that the game runs on. Gameforge gets money by the sale on in-game currency(diamonds) and operates the servers the game runs on. They in turn lease the software from Runewaker.

    Thanks for clarifications :)


    This model is pretty unfamiliar to me. At the company I work for, we are being paid by businesses to deliver the full service for an application that they are requiring: planning, specification writing, coding, testing, deploying, maintaining. But, even though we write the code, the payer has full rights over the project (even the code). They can, anytime, dump us and find another 3rd party to maintain/modify that software


    That's why I had the perception that, either GF owns everything about the game (and RW is just a 3rd party that develops it), either RW owns everything (and they paid GF for publishing/marketing the game, for better exposure)

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from oswayal

    thats not memory leak caused by runes of magic .


    they are not responsible for for errors caused by add ons

    Hello,


    Thank you for your comment. I advice you to remove your addons and run the game in high specs. You will notice that the game will crash eventually.


    Quote from oswayal

    it has more to do with networking and lag than it does programming .

    If you mean that every player on the game has problems with the network, thus causing the crashing, I don't know what to say, sounds very wrong xD. Otherwise, even if it is a bad implementation of the network protocol, or, as I mentioned in the previous posts, it is a memory leak, it's 100% a code mistake.


    Quote from oswayal

    here they at least try to support and even add content to the game .

    if you want help post some system specs , tell us where the fault is .


    Everyone appreciates the support and the new content, but this memory leak has been existing for years now. Posting system specs will not help. I have the specs to run 20 clients at once.

    Also, I cannot point to the fault, as long as I don't have the source code. The code owners are the only ones who can solve it (technically, and legally)


    Quote from oswayal

    ill give you a hint , it aint rom .

    With all respect, you cannot blame anyone else, but the client, and I don't feel giving any further explanations why, because it's obvious that everyone is encountering this problem

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Grumpdaddy

    I suspect they get the same payment from GF per month regardless of how much they spend

    I am not quite sure how this business model works, regarding the above quote. I am thinking that GF is just a platform (just like Steam), where the game was posted, for more exposure. I'd think that RW is paying GF for having the game posted on their platform. Isn't that so ?

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Grumpdaddy
    Quote from pescaru98

    But, in my case, I have an RX 6750XT of 12GB VRAM and 32GB RAM @3200MHz. One client uses 3%-5% of my RAM and VRAM, and the crashes are still going on.

    I have 96gb ram on a Dark Hero MB. I am still crashing, particularly after I portal from anywhere to anywhere. I suspect the system is still hanging on to data from the zone you leave. I'm not saying I have stopped crashing, only that it happens less.

    Hello,



    Regarding moving back and forth through zones, I mentioned in a post on this topic, too. I found here 2 potential problems:

    1. The client caches, purposely, data about all zones he is going through, untill the allocated client memory exceeds

    2. The client is simply not aware to completely clear unnecessary data when a zone is left, and does not even reuse this data when you come back to that zone. It's simply "leaked".


    Also, I've noticed that running the game on "high" graphics will throw the "too-high memory usage" warning very early.


    From my experience, projects that last so much (16 years) are a completely mess. Why? Because of low-budget/high-expectations (which pressures many functionalities in a short amount of time), because of lazy or unexperienced developers, or because of bad technical leading / bad planning. Usually, there's a cocktail of all these


    Such projects need to be remastered. In this case, the game uses RENA game engine, which is a proprietary Runewaker game engine. Maybe 16 years ago, creating a game engine was the only solution. But now, we have open source game engines which are great designed. But of course, remastering such game as RoM will cost alot.


    I understand the difficulty of patching problems, considering the actual state of the game. But. it still generates income, so it should get the deserved support

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Ainz

    idk, have you an answer from runewaker? xD

    Nope :/


    Quote from Fahrenheit

    Your efforts in all honour, but it's not as if Runewaker isn't capable of fixing the problem, it's simply not worth it. They are a profit orientated company and therefore only offer limited support for RoM as they make their money from mobile gaming. Runes of Magic is a cash cow for Gameforge and without financial motivation Runewaker will never fix the game.

    I have the exact same perspective as you. OoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoO


    And yes, as every company that exists, they try to do profit. It's perfectly normal, but normal it is not when you're earning money (as I've heard, a pretty good amount), and not offering support for critical problems, as this memory leak which affects literally everyone. Runewaker should remember that the business model of this game is based on diamond payers (and they should not be mocked). That's probably the only source of income.


    Personally (and I think most of the players think the same), I would accept a delay from the next content, and see the memory leak, as well as the problems with the itemshop, solved.


    Looking forward for further answers from the official team with new updates regarding this problem :)


    Post edited

    Diogenes

  • Game Crashing


    Hello,


    By now, I thought GF owns the intellectual property for the game, but seems that RW does. If RW is both the product owner and the game developer, it might be easier to provide answers to the community :)


    I have written an email to Runewaker, as well

  • Game Crashing

    Hello Diogenes,


    Thank you for the reply!


    Unfortunatelly, this reason of rewritting the client is kind of a very broad explanation. Is there any possibility to understand better why do the development team has to rewrite the client entirely ? A memory leak can origin from a line or a few lines of code, as well as from an error which propagates throughout the entire software project

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Grumpdaddy

    The "Stability improvement" was admitted by the RoM team to be only a "reduced amount of crashes, especially in the cities." I have been able to achieve more stability than the "fix" did by massively increasing Vram and Dram

    The client should work properly on the specified hardware requirements. Depends on your upgrade. But, in my case, I have an RX 6750XT of 12GB VRAM and 32GB RAM @3200MHz. One client uses 3%-5% of my RAM and VRAM, and the crashes are still going on.


    I am not sure how bad was it before the client stability improvement, but there's this test case which always crashes my PC: transporting back and forth to OS, Dalanis, AKR will eventually crash the client.


    Technically speaking, I see 2 potential problems:

    1. The client caches too many variables, that will exceed the memory limit at some point. I'd think this is not the case with the client. This can be probably fixed with a better management of the allocated memory, or just increasing the client allocated memory

    2. The client does not deallocate variables at their lifecycle end, so the memory keeps growing and growing, as new variables are being allocated, like a snowball. This is not fixable with more memory allocation. I'll be curious to monitor how the memory is growing when transporting between OS, Dalanis and AKR

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Fossilo

    Hello, I will make sure to forward again this topic to the RoM team.


    Just a little background, 3 years ago we had a Client Stability improvement patch which helped substantially with the crashes, but it is possible that with the current state of the game and the client other problems will occur, so we will investigate :)

    Hello Fossilo,


    Thank you for your reply. I read about the client stability improvement. Unfortunatelly, it is not mentioned what the client stability improvement means, in a more detailed and technical way. Also, the improvement may have not fixed the memory leak in the end.


    I am looking forward with excitement to hear more about this topic

  • Game Crashing

    Quote from Ainz

    we assume that GF has no rights to change the Client-Code by themself since runewaker is the developer. so most likely no one from gf can say anything about that problem other than "we forwarded it to rw"

    I understand that. The community will state problems to GF. GF are, then, responsible for forwarding the problems and provide answers back to the community.


    For me, it's unclear if something has been done in those years to fix the problem. If any budget was allocated in researching and fixing this problem, or it has just been ignored all this time. I personally need some answers, and I will not spend any more dollars until I don't get some answers that something has been done in regard of solving the game crashing

  • Game Crashing

    Hello,


    I wanted to come up with a topic that has been discussed many times in the past, and whom represent a really big frustration for any of the Runes of Magic players. That is, the game crashing caused by the memory leaks


    I've read the existent topics, which most of the times stated that you could lower the game crashes by lowering graphics, removing interface load, using external software which cleans the memory, and so on. Those solutions will not grant the fix, they will just delay the crashing


    What I would love to see from the Runes of Magic technical team is a more comprehensive, more technical answer regarding the problem. I understand that, at a specific level, there are security risks in revealing technical informations, but if there is anything the official team can share, maybe someone can come up with advices in solving the problem. I heard there are private Runes of Magic servers that managed to fix the problem, so why are the officials not able to do so ?


    I work in the Software Engineering industry, and i'd love to contribute in solving this problem, if possible.