What's the best talisman for a w/m (pve)

  • Hi, as the title say , i was wondering which talisman is the best for a w/m (for endgame inis). I'm using Annelia's one, with magical dmg and i was wondering if ini's talisman isn't better ? Does someone has made some tests and could tell me which one is the best ?

  • Wing of the Dragonking (crafted, recipe not available anymore but plenty of players who own the recipe) - gives 9.6% Fire Magic Power at t8. This increases your Flame Attack by a considerable margin, much more so than using Annelia talisman with mdmg or instance talisman (matt is not really an issue on w/m anyway).

  • There is no question, it is just the best talisman you can get and it's quite easy to get, what do you want to hear? ^^

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  • In theory, it should be available from the rare magic weapon scroll which in turn should be available from Ancient Treasure Chests (Sascilia Minigame) ... while I'm sure of the scroll I'm not sure that the Treasure Chests still can give one of those scrolls ... the data I have is a bit confusing in this regard.



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  • I believe you have to be a certain lvl character (50ish?) and run through goblin mines

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  • Okok i'll try this one instead of annelia. Do you guys know a sweet spot to get steel nails ?

    I believe you have to be a certain lvl character (50ish?) and run through goblin mines

    The highest level character who is on goblin mine while you start the minigame has to be around the level of the item (30-35 iirc), you main can join after the mobs have spawned (if you don't kill any before). Maybe you have to experient with the level a little bit.




    I expected more answers with ppl who made tests and confirm that this talisman is the best. Not that i don't trust aktl but one opinion does not mean this is the truth ^^

    You can just do the math:

    • Annelia talisman increases your mdmg by how many %?
    • The fire thing increases your fire damage by 9 or so %, so that's about 5% of your total damage (look at your scruti how much % of your damage is fire to get a accurate number)

    Usually, the fire talisman is much better

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  • Indeed, it's not that simple. The best Talisman highly depends on your magical damage and your flame attack's damage output.


    The tier that you upgrade your tali is important too.


    Since you got the 60 elite skill, your DPS is balanced - or almost - beetwen Flame and Electrick attack.


    With the wing of dragonking, you boost your Flame attack only and it results in 10% more damages.


    But with Annelia's toy (not sur for the English name of this tali), you got a raw magical damage boost.


    At the end, it's simple maths :

    • if you the magical damage boost for Annelia is about or more than 5% of your magical damages, and since it will boost both Electrick and Flame Attack, this tali is the best. And by the way, with a one handed staff, and a R8/9 Tali, this last for long in the game.
    • if the 10% fire boost for you Flame attack is higher than the Annelia's magical damage boost, on the average damage output of this skill, then the Wing of the Dragonking is the best.

    My point is maybe a bit oudated since we now can easily reach 10K+ magical damages and it was already possible since chapter 6 was released with a high amount of damage on Bethomia HM one handed staff and torso, but for the leveling phase, or if you're playing like we were used to in the good old days, Annelia's usualy remain the best until Betho, depending on your weapon plussing and tiering.

  • if you the magical damage boost for Annelia is about or more than 5% of your magical damages, and since it will boost both Electrick and Flame Attack, this tali is the best. And by the way, with a one handed staff, and a R8/9 Tali, this last for long in the game.

    IIRC, the magical damage bonus from Annelia does not scale with tier, so R8/9 is useless for that one. The other one (fire damage) does.

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  • Really ? My bad so. But I remembered in the end of Chapter IV that our priest was playing with it and after dropping it HD, we made a bunch of CharPlan simulation to determine if Annelia's or bonus heal tali was the best with the big damage boost from Annelia's.


    Really weird tho, but I guess that my memories aren't that clear.

  • Really ? My bad so. But I remembered in the end of Chapter IV that our priest was playing with it and after dropping it HD, we made a bunch of CharPlan simulation to determine if Annelia's or bonus heal tali was the best with the big damage boost from Annelia's.


    Really weird tho, but I guess that my memories aren't that clear.

    No you are correct.


    The Annelia Toy magic damage scales with tier, the shields do not.


    The toy is the best Talisman for warrior mage. With both at t9 the toy was giving about 10% more overall damage.


    - talisman magic damage adds to your base raw magic damage which means it increases with buffs, etc

    - dragonking is just a calculation on flame attack after the fact.


    The dragonking is cheap and at lower tiers is probably the better starter talisman.

  • Incorrect. Dragonking is far and away the best talisman.

    At T8 Dragonking gives 9.6% fire dmg. At same tier the toy gives 327.6 mdmg. That is a very small boost for w/m.

    -You forget also that W/M fire damage is increased by 36% (wl/m soul brand debuff)

    -Mdmg increases with buffs yes but so does your flame attack :

    I.E, wd/s + ch/p buffs are going to increase your flame attack more with wing of the dragonking than they would with annelia's toy.





    Calculations are not perfect, but they are a good illustration as to why annelia's toy is NOT better than wing of the dragonking.


    Mdmg increase without Toy :


    Increases from 20.000 to 36.079 (increase of 16.079mdmg or an increase of 80%).



    With toy :


    20327.6 base mdmg.


    Food: (20327.6+400)*1.12+400 = 23615

    D/wd : (23615+165)*1.1+165 = 26323

    Ch/P+Wd/S : 26323*1.2*1.16 = 36642 mdmg.


    Increase from 20000 (base should be 20327, but let's give even more benefit to toy) to 36642 (increase of 16642 mdmg or an increase of 83%).



    So as you can see, it only increases my mdmg by 3%. Still less than dragonking. Needs to be 6% or so to be better - 60% of my damage is from flame attack, and it increases flame attack by 10%. So 60%/10% for 6%.

    Edited 5 times, last by aktl ().

  • The Annelia Toy magic damage scales with tier, the shields do not.

    The shields also scale with tier. I was thinking about plussing, the talisman does not scale with plus level, the shields do.


    Anyway, even on tier 15, Annelias talisman gives you about 500 m. damage.

    A normal one-hand staff (about t12+20) gives you about 15k m. damage.


    As aktl calculated correctly, t15 Annelia gives you a 3% damage boost while even a t10 dragon king thing gives you 11% fire boost (so more that 5% damage boost since you do about 50% fire/electric damage). Dragon king wing is buch better *and* much easier to get.

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  • Thank you Karza for confirming. My memories aren't that bad ! :)


    Indeed, you're right Rynak but with a Chapter 6+ one handed staff, for end game (or end game since 3 years now...).


    That's why I was as clear as possible in my explanation : Annelia's toy is and remain the best until the damage boost it gives represent less than 5% of your magical damages.


    It could be more complicated, depending on the food, the buffs, the pots, the burst buff your group can give you... That's why I was talking about a general situation.


    When we were at Grafu Hard / TOSH hard progress at the end of the chapter 4, my weapon was the GHM one handed staff, T8 + 16, with 5.304 magical damages.

    Once TOSH hard was clean, I had TOSH hard one handed staff, T10 + 16, with 7.031 magical damages.


    With Annelia's toy T8 +16 and stated, HD obviously, we're at 327 magical damages.


    Then, it's simple :

    • With GHM one handed staff, we got 6.1% magical damage boost from Annelia's toy. More than 5%. So, Annelia's toy is the best choice.
    • With TOSH HM one handed staff, we got 4,65% magical damage boost from Annelia's toy. Less than 5%. So, Annelia's toy is not the best choice anymore.

    And the trend goes on since that point. Everytime next zone and new ini and weapon, the raw damage on the one handed staff is bigger and scale even higher with dura, plussing and tiering.


    Then the difference which was pretty small between GHM and TOSH HM weapon tends to grow and with my 92 lvl craft staff, Annelia's toy magical damage boost is just above 3%. And it will decrease all over the time.


    So yes, maybe you're all assuming that everybody is end game, full geared with lvl 95-100 HM inis drop, but I don't think that's the best way to answer question.

    There is no unique answer, the best talisman in the game depends on your one handed staff magical damage.

  • There is no unique answer, the best talisman in the game depends on your one handed staff magical damage.


    Hi, as the title say , i was wondering which talisman is the best for a w/m (for endgame inis).


    I agree, this is an interesting discussion, but the original question was this and wing of the dragonking was the clear answer. I hope that these diversions do not confuse anyone

  • Oups, it seems that I focused more on the topic's title than the original question in the first post. My bad.


    By the way rastadready can you inform us about the difference beetwen your actual tali and the Wing of Dragonking, and post here the damage output you get in both cases ?


    Other question - maybe a bit off topic - I remember you on Claiomh, so I guess you're playing on Nuada. If you're able to craft the Wing of Dragonking, I'm pretty interest by it and if you're aggree with that, I would like to buy you an HD one ;)