Some ideas on Siege War

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  • Sarkas asked us to post suggestions and support them with likes. Here are some ideas to make sieges more interesting.


    1. Restrict last second fearless capping for those who don't really fight and just sit in the castle holding the gates for the whole hour.

    For example, every minute one guild holds all towers subtracts one second from the latest allowed occupation timeframe. For example, if the blue guild held all towers for 15 full minutes, all red occupations must be done by SW end time minus 15 seconds. If reds want to do last minute cap they should keep retaking at least some towers.

    Another suggestion was already made on the forum before. All 6 towers takes by one guild start a countdown, say 5 minutes and victory if nothing changes. Next countdown will be smaller, like 4:30 and so on.


    2. Gates can be practically unkillable with enough protecting alts . Is it technically possible to make rams ignore ch/m high-energy barrier? Motivation: if a weaker guild cannot even kill rams then it's better end this fast and avoid wasting time.


    3. Extend ranking calculation. Currently it's only based on the SW outcome. But there are more factors which are relevant to the actual guild's combat strength. For example, taking a crystal can result in 20% points transfer, not 10%. As well as who controlled most towers for most time, number of kills etc. Also last minute fearless capping can be taken into account.


    4. Forbid entering siege war for players with crashing buffs. Ideally together with making these buffs cancellable.

  • 1) Immunity cap, for how much is despicable tactic, is the only way to balance a sw agaist high spending money ppl with 30+ gear. Changing it can lead to other problems.

    Instead, to solve both problem 1-2, i would suggest to link gates to the 6 towers: if one team capture all of them, gates start to loose hp or cant be buffed.


    2) Better and more effective siege weapons would be nice too, against a good guild those last 30 sec at gates, against weak one can still be useless cause of alts buff on gates. We still unlocked only lv 3 of them while the arsenal can reach lv 10. RN can surprice us there.



    4) RN could also be so nice to actually fix the buff visual effect

    Wiped at 0% Will's Curse - Medusa - Andriol - Vrantal - Charionys - Naos - Yawaka - Gugolar

  • 1. I think a guild should be able to take towers right before the end. If all of their towers are taken, then they have to take back 3 for a draw or 4 for a win. If a guild is able to get such an advantage, they should be able to protect the crystals before the enemies can capture them.

    I like the second part for a countdown if all towers are taken. The Siege War rules on the battles screen actually says "The team that has seized all of the towers or the enemy's Guild Honor Crystal for 5 minutes, wins." However, this might lead to faster wins and people won't even bother attacking the castle if they can just win by taking all the crystals and defending them for 5 minutes.


    2. This should be possible. Heal over time effects do not work on any buildings. I haven't tried with any protection buffs though. I don't know how bad the ch/m buff is, but my guess is that they made walls resistant to buffs and never updated it when the new race came.


    3. I'm ok with except for the part on fearless capturing. Get a lead or risk having it taken from you at the last second. You know they'll want to take their towers back, so prepare for it. Both sides can have a herald that can use fearless. If you're afraid the enemy will take the game by fearless capturing, get another just in case by doing the exact same thing. If the enemy takes the tower at the end of the game and end up with a win/tie while you're asleep at the wheel, it's your fault you lost.


    4. I'm more in favor in fixing the problems that causes the crashing rather than punishing people for buffing. Buffing is a part of the game and unless the buffs are completely unfair to the players, then it shouldn't be restricted. Also, fixing the buff prevents the problem happening anywhere else. (In this case, it would probably be better to make a bug report or another suggestions thread to push for these specific buffs to be fixed.)

    Signature coming soon. Maybe.

  • 2. This should be possible. Heal over time effects do not work on any buildings. I haven't tried with any protection buffs though. I don't know how bad the ch/m buff is, but my guess is that they made walls resistant to buffs and never updated it when the new race came.

    Problem is gate are subscettible of buff like any other player. Ch/m buff absorb dmg in % of HP, and since gates got tons of hp they are virtually immune to any dmg.

    Wiped at 0% Will's Curse - Medusa - Andriol - Vrantal - Charionys - Naos - Yawaka - Gugolar

  • Just to clarify, I'm not against last second fearcaps, they are an interesting aspect. The suggestions were addressing the case of not fighting at all and only hoping for the last cap. Reducing total siege war time in these situations might be a solution as well.

    Ultimately most of the suggestions were to make a better matching algorithm. It's no fun fighting much strong or much weaker opponents.

  • Don't get me wrong, I don't want to bash on you with the following but you obviously never played against skilled guilds who know how to fcap.

    There is no possible way to protect yourself against fcap if the rogue is skilled, you can place 100 fire towers between enemy castle and middle towers a rogue will still just pass by and invis + fcap your tower without any problems.


    The problem is the combination of both, there are enough guilds nowdays who have 2 ch/m + wl + p/wl behind each door (no possible way of breaking through) and then hold their castle for 60min just to fcap enough towers at the end, which is no fun at all and in my eyes also no victory.


    In all honesty, a guild should win by default if they manage to have more then 50% towers for atleast 75% of the sw, doesn't matter if the enemy guild fcaps towers at last seconds then.

  • i think nobody would have a problem with a guild that fight 59 minutes and then fcap. so i love the idea ... if a guild hold all 6 towers over a time ... siege is over/won. i dont know what time is good .... 5 min or 7 min ??

  • Whatever rules, whatever restrictions are placed... people will find ways around :)


    I think the best of both worlds would be to allow a win if all 6 towers are capped for 5 minutes. That's plenty of time for a guild to re-cap at least 1 tower.

  • Don't get me wrong, I don't want to bash on you with the following but you obviously never played against skilled guilds who know how to fcap.

    There is no possible way to protect yourself against fcap if the rogue is skilled, you can place 100 fire towers between enemy castle and middle towers a rogue will still just pass by and invis + fcap your tower without any problems.

    I haven't seen this happen in US servers. Chill lol.

    Still, you need to capture multiple towers at once if you expect to win (under the assumption that they all hid behind castle waiting for the end). Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying there are no ways to stop a skilled rouge from approaching the tower? Scouts can use detect and there is something you can place down to stun all invisible enemies. Do they happen to find their way around those eyes? There is no possible way?

    Please explain more.


    Don't get me wrong, I agree that practically indestructible gates are a problem and there should be a winning condition if you have all of the towers for a certain amount of time. Just fixing those would help against this fear capping problem.

    Signature coming soon. Maybe.

  • I haven't seen this happen in US servers. Chill lol.

    if you want i can search an old video from the us servers. there was a siege 6 towers facp an the end against to strongest guild.



    but you're saying there are no ways to stop a skilled rouge from approaching the tower?

    and he is right !

  • Rogue Item set skill from zs/ds lv 55 and from tos lv 100 let rogues walk in hide and ignore any kind of trap, eyes included. Scout can detect them ofc but usually rogues run at full speed when they fcap and got immunity pretty fast so the only way would be to have a pretty fast scout to react in 1 sec.

    In case of r/p they can use early immunity so its pretty impossible to stop them on their way. The only safeway is to have a p/r close and use skill purge on them to remove the herald immunity while they are capping.


    Btw any rogue who use invi pots has no rogue pride =)

    Wiped at 0% Will's Curse - Medusa - Andriol - Vrantal - Charionys - Naos - Yawaka - Gugolar

    Edited once, last by Searius ().

  • Rogue Item set skill from zs/ds lv 55 and from tos lv 100 let rogues walk in hide and ignore any kind of trap, eyes included. Scout can detect them ofc but usually rogues run at full speed when they fcap and got immunity pretty fast so the only way would be to have a pretty fast scout to react in 1 sec.

    In case of r/p they can use early immunity so its pretty impossible to stop them on their way. The only safeway is to have a p/r close and use skill purge on them to remove the herald immunity while they are capping.

    totaly right. and there is an other thing they should change in siege. the most rouges are hidding in the mountains. they should disabled the area behind the castle and in the mountains.

  • Please send the video. I want to see it lol.


    Yeah, I can see this being a problem with all of the immune effects mentioned. It seems difficult to regulate this by itself... Do you all think the other suggestions posted would fix this?

    Signature coming soon. Maybe.

  • None here is against fear cap, it's part of the sw. Utui referred to guilds who just hide till last few minutes and try to cap majority of towers.

    In a fight between balanced guilds you can see fcap every 3 min, with actual fights. The cases utui presented involve cases in which there is 1 hour stall, purposefull or not, resolved in the last 30 secs.

    Wiped at 0% Will's Curse - Medusa - Andriol - Vrantal - Charionys - Naos - Yawaka - Gugolar

  • My biggest frustration with Siege War is the following:


    I crash regularly during SW and lose my merrits than. That sucks but I can understand that to a certain extent. But why on earth do your wounds worsen when you reenter SW? Feel really unfair to lose ability as well when you get an unwanted crash...

  • one of the main problems is rogues invisibility potion fear-capping and guilds that cant "fight" vs opp just keeps gate with ch/m and priest/warlock alts, i would personally like to see invisibility potion not able to be used in player vs player arenas (ofc i know that will bring a lot of problems with other "buffs") (like universal potions) OR better is what Utu said which make invisibility potion not "usable or stack-able" when a player is fearless and some sort of Nerf to either priest/warlock or champion/mage make it so for ch/m cool-down on high energy barrier has a longer cool-down than the skill duration) or make priest/warlock life surge only affect things in raid (not whats in radius)

  • Invis pots have a large usage apart from invis capping towers and they shouldn't be removed from pvp areas, equally invis pots and fearless can be stacked elsewhere which is advantageous and i wouldnt want to see this removed either. The easiest solution would be to remove the pots usage around the radius of the tower, equally the same script to apply this could be used on rams to stop them being shoved inside the tower to try to prevent it being clicked.


    Gate alts are a tricky one to balance, as we dont want it like in the past when castles were broken every sw and equally we dont want it to be impossible to break. A large issue with breaking into castles is that you can only purchase 15 scrolls per war, and due to the large number of crashes recieved during siege, near the end a lot of these have been wasted. Similarly to how runewaker did in the past with the forge buffs etc, merits and all sw items should be given a 1 hour timer upon entry to your bag as well, this would mean even if you crash you could keep your items. The script for placing them would need to be adjusted however as you can currently place them all around the world lol. Gates should be made immune to all player buffs and have a new permanent buff applied to them that reduces damage by players to 0, but increase heals recieved by a %. Reduce the % of damage that aoes do to encourage usage of rams. Maybe add an item that lets players heal the gate too for x% so that if a guild doesn't have a healer they wont lose gate every war.


    And finally, please lower the damage and heals serverside for pvp areas and zones, the server already has a broken option for dots and pvp damage, just ask runewaker to fix it and update it to reduce heals too, the damage in pvp areas is just insane.

  • To my mind 3 'simple' changes would be enough to make siege war a real war again:


    1 - towercapping only when all guards on this tower are down ;)


    2 - gates (all buildings) can´t be buffed anymore, heals to gates are reduced to 25% of actual value, damage of tornado, scrolls and players to gates are reduced to 50%


    3 - rams should get high damage (breaking down after ~10s) when placed near towers.


    This would be enough to make it way better than now.

    The rest is fine-tuning but since Runewaker and Greedforge only know sledgehammer approaches the easiest solutions should be the first to be implemented.